forget terraforming (was: Mars Society defense)

Bill wrote:
> Has anyone ever seriously sat down and figured out what is needed
to terraform Mars?

Lots. Mega-tons of space infrastructure (the dirty word to
Zubrin-ites, even though he specifies it's needed for terraforming),
and centuries and millennia. Sure, we might be able to have tailored
bacteria survive within 50 years, but what good is that?
No, terraforming isn't within our range of possibilities now. Even
if we can dream up ways to do it, it does us no good. You're going to
convince Uncle Sam to foot the bill? For a centuries-long program
that returns not one cent to the taxpayers for millennia? You're
going to do it with private donations? (Maybe, but the donors will be
living in space colonies by then).

>> But in orbital habitats, the new environments can be tailored to
fit the requirements of presently-existing animals.
>
> Considering the majority of those animals are going to be humans, I
think this is a good thing.

Sorry, Mars Society fanatics, but space colonies are going to be the
second branch of human civilization.

>> On a terraformed Mars, many animals will evolve to the new
environment.

B.S. What good does this do for us? How does this pay back the
investment? How does this give the next generations of people options
for new living areas? In any case, you're not talking about
preserving life we have now, but making new life to live there. Maybe
worthwhile, but again; so what?

Back to Mars Society defense:
As much as I criticise some within the Mars Society for the fuzzy
thinking that strict adherence to Zubrin's writings brings, I still
say that a human Mars mission is very worthwhile, and could be done
with a goal of leading to greater things in space for the future.
I think Diemos is the key, forgotten by Zubrin, unknown to his
fanatical followers. (possibly ignored by Zubrin, because it implies
useful space infrastructure, and we can't have that)
If we want a good, robust Mars exploration program (which seems to
be the fashion since no one, taxpayer or elected civil master wants a
one-shot, go no-where program), then a base of operations, leading to
more sufficiency is needed.
Diemos also lets the program show a profit, and it's a perfect place
for a rotating shielded habitat to be built (Sorry, L-5 fans, but
HEEO is a close second). It also brings volatiles to LEO, which any
Lunar resources plan needs.
It lets everyone win.