Human Relationships in a Habitat

> From: victoriatangoman [mailto:tango_dancer@...]

> Let me be more explicit in my point because I think you missed it
> entirely.
>
> For those high pressure personal scenarios that size of community or
> distance away may solve, a small Habitat may become a pressure
> cooker. Al Globus responded that he lives in a small town and these
> dynamics aren't at work. I questioned whether his small town
> experience is really limited to the small town, or does he have
> access to the environs of a larger community.
>
> On Earth, you may live in a small town of 10,000 people, but if your
> little hamlet is 50 miles outside of NYC, then NYC is available to
> you as a resource. People can work there, socialize there, shop
> there, etc. Your life isn't confined to the environs of the town.
> You have options available to you.

You're saying a small colony would be viewed as a prison by those who lived there, as they would not be able to leave.

> That isn't available to you at L5.

On Earth there are these little things called 'islands', and some of them contain a hell of a lot less than 10,000 people. They seem to survive quite happily with little contact with the outside world.

> Now tell me the point of your response, because I missed how a book
> shelf, books, 500 tons of total books, buying things,
> and "collective education farms" support a coherent point. What is
> it that you're trying to say?

1) Your assumptions are based on life on Earth, and are notappropiet to an orbital colony.
2) That the colony would *never* be completely isolated from the outside world.
3) The colony would not be a completely static enviroment.

An Island 1 colony is going to weight... say ten million tons? Most of that conctere, steel and glass. What little remains would be the biomass and machinery needed to sustain the colony. There simply would not be enough mass left inside the colony to produce marketable goods. If you import the colony is going to gain weight quickly. Introducing all that exotic material into the colony is also going to play havoc with life-support due to toxin build up. Therefore actual goods are likely to be expensive, and shopping in the conventional sense is unlikely to happen, except for special occasions. This was made in response to your question, 'Do you do all your shopping in your home town?' I believe the question shows poor understanding of colony dynamics on your part.

Seeing as people are talking about building colonies in 4 years these people do not have problems with moving large ammounts of material from the moon to L5. If rock is easy to move, people must be even easier. If peopel are to colonise these places it *must* be relatively easy. You ask how would people live if there was nowhere else for them to go? But surely if they can be sent there they can also leave? Commuting would not be possible, but weekend trips to resorts on the moon would be. Or summer holidays on Earth.

The colony superstructure is going to be fixed. Arcitecture inside is going to be regulated to keep the colony balanced. However at each end there is zero gravity, and additional construction on the outside can be done easily and cheeply in a way that would not impact severely on the colony. If you want an escape resort and can't afford to leave the colony, build a small ring station (100m diameter?) in the 0G section and sell high prices.

>
> > > I tend to think that modern life, with its long commutes to
> work,
> > > with neighbors that are strangers, with its suburban sprawl, is
> the
> > > safety valve of modern life. If you are confined to interact
> with
> > > only those 10,000 people your life becomes less varied.
> >
> > Because of course this colony would not have any telephones or
> internet access would it? Or zero-gravity sports? Or television?
> Presumably everyone in it also comes from exactly the same culture
> and shares the same beliefs and values you do?
> > And I imagine that intereacting with all of those 10,000 people
> every day must get rather monotonous, not to mention tiring.
>
> Your attempt at sarcasm isn't working very well.

Yet you sem to assume the complete lack of telecommunications, and that even if they existed they would have no significant benifit to colony society. Perhaps you feel peopel would not accept them as substitutes for 'the real thing'? Personally I assume such people would not be the first choice for admitance to the colony.

> There is more to socializing than playing an online game or
> participating in a discussion forum. It's nice to actually be with
> people, to get away from "shop talk", to go to concerts, plays,
> movies.

If I want to go the the local Cineworld, I go there at a whim. If I want to go to the Sydney Opera House, I spend a year or more saving money. Te ame distinction will be made by colonists. They will make the best use they can of the local facilities, and if they really want more they'll plan holidays or move.

> On Earth, even if you live in a small town, all of the features of
> big cities are available to you.

And exactly what facilities do you think will not be available even on a small colony, considdering what they can fit on a (much smaller) cruise ship? You may be limited to one cinema multiplex and one concert hall, but that need not limit the range of tallents, acts, or performers.

> If, in your small town, your wife takes up with your best friend,
> you make a complete ass of yourself when you're drunk, you have a
> feud with your neighbor, coworker, boss, or some other disaster or
> embarassment falls upon you, you can spend a lot of your time away
> from the town until things cool down, or actually move. These
> options aren't available to you at L5.

If you make an ass of yourself at work (and many do) you can't just move away either. At least not unless you have huge piles of money lying about. Then again if you have that much money... And I disagree with you about the last sentence.

And based on the pictures I've seen, if you want to get away just get a job in on of the exterior farm habitats. Maybe overseeing the automated machinery? Might be boring, but you would have 'gotten away'.

> Some people handle these issues better than others. They're not the
> ones I'm curious about. Some guy may have no problem with his
> cheating wife living across the street from him with his former best
> friend, and seeing them every day. Other guys may go ballistic at
> the sight of them every day. It's the latter situation that I'm
> pondering.

I imagine there would be a screening process involved in applicants for the colony.

> My post was addressing what happens when things go wrong in the
> personal relationships of people. This is usually what drives people
> nutso.

They leave or get chucked out or are given a Darwin Award or put into solitary on the outside. Alternatively the cheeting slut and her lover (for exampled) might be expelled as a fairer result than punishing the victim.

> You seem to be saying that if a person on the Habitat wants to avoid
> people he should lock himself into his house and play video games,
> watch DVD movies, or log onto the internet.

That was in answer to your implication that people could not interact with others outside the colony. In practice, any single colonist is only going to know a hundred others or so and in a population of 10,000 there's plenty of opertunities to get away from the people you want to avoid, and meet new people.

ANTIcarrot.