Getting paid in space

Re: [spacesettlers] Re: Getting paid in space
Darren darrenb500 wrote:
Doug,
First, I have to agree with you, no system is perfect and when you have
people involved you will inevitably have some that will try to abuse the
system but that is what the police are for but then you run into the
problem
of politicians who will want to work the system for their benefit,
this is a
problem for the politics of the time and the law enforcement of the
habitat.
I am going to ignore the problems of bad guys doing things they
shouldnt
because that becomes a matter of law and politics and that is outside the
scope of this thread.

---This is appropriate regardless of the medium of exchange. There are
speculators
of any commodity including currencies. They will drive the value up
and down to
profit any way they can.---

No,
all habitats will be Green to a much greater degree than we are down here.
Now some may argue that they recycle more, and use less to do more,
well so
what, power in space is not a limited resource, there are huge masses of
metal just floating around out there.

---I agree. The habitats in good locations will have excess energy or
material of
one or more types over the habitats in other locations and on moons or
planets.
Any matter or energy will have variable value depending on where and
when it is
available. Short supply of aluminum on a habitat will cause the value
of it to go
up at the same time an overage at another site will cause the value to
go down there.
Profit will be made by transporting the shortage materials to the
location required
from the location where it is readily available.---

There is going to be every kind of economy possible but if they trade
among
themselves there has to be some way of deciding what the Zlotys used in
Hab-XYZ-123are worth against the Pounds used in Hab-ABC-321and the Drachma
used in Hab-ZYX-321and the Lira used in Hab CBA-123.

---Again, I agree. The true value of ANY commodity will be a variable
according to
location and availability. This includes the commodity chosen as money.---

We have a situation like this today in the EU, with the Euro but this
currency is having problems because some of the members of the Euro group
have stronger economies than others and the governments and banks must
work
hard to keep the currency within the self-imposed limits they have
set. The
question we must ask is why are they having such a hard time keeping the
currency in the range they have set? The answer is simple, the Euro is a
fiat currency, it only has the value the banks/government/markets say it
has, so the policy makers have to set policies that the banks and markets
interpret as being in line with keeping the currency inside the limits set
by the governments. With each government having different weaknesses and
strengths this become a constant juggling act, of course if the
currency was
based on a ** GOLD ** standard then this would not be such a
problem but
it would have its own different problems.

---Any chosen standard will have the same problems. This is the main
reason I
think the luna.tic based on hydrogen is the best solution. Hydrogen is
readily
available everywhere in the universe. Of course, some areas are short
of it
and will require importing from elsewhere, i.e. Lunar surface.
However, if the
currency is worth one liter of hydrogen at standard pressure and
temperature,
the relative values of other commodities, including energy will fluctuate
against one another and the currency--just as all commodities do
today, regardless
of the currency used as a measuring stick. The value of a liter of
gasoline
and the value of a gram of gold are not tied together in the USA or
Iraq or
Australia, nor are their respective currencies tied together. They all
fluctuate.
I have changed my mind about 100 tics to the luna, though. I now
believe, for
convience sake that a luna should be 1000 tics, or a cubic meter of
hydrogen
per luna.---

and all I can say is, WHY???? As for those who overproduce power,
again why?
Even if energy is cheap, it still has some small cost and generating power
just to boost the value of your currency, the cost of generating the power
would eat up the gain you get for the extra power. The thing here Doug
is I
think you are making a very common mistake, people use to think that
because
Gold was money, then Gold itself had value, this is not the case, Gold has
value because it is rare. There are rarer metals than Gold but it is used
for historical reasons and because it does not tarnish, if you used Gold
only for its practical uses, it cost would drop quickly. Having energy
backing the currency should not lead anybody into thinking that energy
itself is what has the value (okay, before anybody tells me, YES, I know
that energy has value, what I mean here is that the joules are not
thing you
spend), the other thing to remember is I keep saying ENERGY, not
electricity, if you use artificial lighting in your habitat or you use
large
mirrors to reflect sunlight, so what, both are energy.

What I am proposing is that the wealth (and the currency) of a society is
linked to the energy usage of that society.

I do not think an energy bases system is going to be used by everybody, I
just offer it as a way to have the stability of a **GOLD** standard
with the
flexibility of a fiat currency but without the problems, as I first
said, it
is a compromise.

---I can make the same argument for hydrogen...it is the most common
element
in the universe. Therefore, it would be used as a unit of measure, not a
store of value. It has value in and of itself and can be used at will. It
is available in various levels of readiness at various locations and is a
commodity in a fluctuating marketplace, regardless of location and
relative
value to other commodities. I do not expect the luna.tic to be physical
hydrogen handed over the counter for the nice tomato for your salad. I
expect it to be handled electronically for the most part. That being said,
a liter of hydrogen on the moon will be worth more than a liter on the
surface of Earth, and both would be different than the value of it on a
ship coming into port at Deimos station. The physical backing of the
currency
will have different values at different times and places, regardless of
what that backing commodity is.

This is an interesting thread and I don't think we will come to an
agreement
that the world will accept for ever and always, but we might come to the
agreement that money, be it 'real', 'fiat', 'gold standard' or 'fairy
dust'
is merely a method of keeping score. Anything can be used as a
standard unit
to keep score of who owes what to whom.

Thanks for the information and comments,

Harvey